Gender & Sexuality with Diana Cage & Professor C: Part Two

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Gender & Sexuality with Diana Cage & Professor C: Part Two

 

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Comments [55]

Lake's picture

Understanding you lately has

Understanding you lately has become so difficult. If I'm a bully for asking a question ....what does that make you for putting peoples thoughts and feelings down. Everytime I'm on.... you are all over the place...That's fine as long as you show respect to everyone. I'm not saying you have to agree...just show some respect for what's being said. The need to add to everything is a little overbearing and kinda like being a bully.

Lake

dlcottage's picture

I Agree thats one of the

I Agree thats one of the reason's Im out of a 30 year marriage with my husband !! Damn took me long enough to realize that, ouch!!!!

Peace out
Rosie

DogLover33's picture

Me too!

Me too Rosie! Only mine was for 19 years LOL. So what are you now that your not married? The butch or femme?

Not2Taem's picture

For Tex re coffee: I think it

For Tex re coffee: I think it depends on whether you take it with cream. Wink

Allegra's picture

Oh Yonks you are very tidy

Oh Yonks you are very tidy and gentle ! I ll put you on my list !!!

Steph H's picture

How did we get from brands of

How did we get from brands of tea to monogamy? lol.

LongBeachDogLover's picture

I certainly think it's better

I certainly think it's better to look like our lovers, than our dogs !! Laughing out loud

Tex's picture

Tae, it's just tea there and

Tae, it's just tea there and catfish here! Woman, you have me all partnered up every time I turn around....do I need to be worried about the coffee in Austin?

Nothing but love

Tex

Twitter Time @kdhales

Professor Crandall's picture

Thanks, tomboy! D got it for

Thanks, tomboy! D got it for me, so congratulations on your excellent taste. They're on sale & i think we both should have them in every color (comes with matching hanky!)

http://www.ecstar.net/shop/productlisting.cfm?ID=30

Xanadu's picture

I think so!

I think so!

yonks's picture

if there's not enough room,

if there's not enough room, we can tighten on each other Smile

-Do not follow me, I'M LOST-

Not2Taem's picture

Nicely put, Rusty.

Nicely put, Rusty. Personally, I don't do the label thing. I think at a certain point in my life I just had too much of people expecting me to fit into their little boxes. But I do understand that some people find great comfort in their labels, being able to name that which is their strength and essence. Wouldn't it be nice if we could just all truly make room for each others differences and needs?

Dare to dream,
Laughing out loud

Not2Taem's picture

Not butch, Yonks. Just a

Not butch, Yonks. Just a skunk. But lovable still.

Smile

Not2Taem's picture

Holding door - a new social

Holding door - a new social norm?

Long ago I noticed that most men were uncomfortable when I held a door for them, often refusing to continue through. Now this rarely happens and strangers most often simple say thank you and proceed. Is it possible that our willingness to be who we are despite society's reaction to it is paying off?

Not2Taem's picture

Just wondering Steph, if this

Just wondering Steph, if this is a love ritual for you, then would making tea for Tex constitute cheating? Of course, that presumes a monogamous base to the relationship, so perhaps not.

Rambling minds want to know Cool

Not2Taem's picture

Nothing like tying one on

Nothing like tying one on with a sweet teddy. Laughing out loud

yonks's picture

woah, thats sweeet

woah, thats sweeet

-Do not follow me, I'M LOST-

yonks's picture

Yea i know what you mean,

Yea i know what you mean, sometime, peoples get troubles with a butch like five hear ago and they jump in your face... or they pretend that butch-femme run all the space and there is no room for them but i don't know, i don't feel like there's lot of room for us either.

-Do not follow me, I'M LOST-

yonks's picture

exactly, so, when its time to

exactly, so, when its time to paid at the restorant, i play femme, when its time to wash the dishes, i play bucht, you fill up the refrigerator, i empty it, you undust the television, i sit on the couch to watch it, i put crumbs on the couch you.... well, it seems that i still have more butch side on me lol

-Do not follow me, I'M LOST-

LongBeachDogLover's picture

Ohhhhh Tae........

Ohhhhh Tae........ *sigh*

Did you just say big boobs? *sigh again* Well, to me... boobs are neither butch nor femme, just simply fabulous !! *deep sigh*

A girl sporting her favorite tie (just her tie), and me in my favorite teddy ........

What more need I say. Wink

diana cage's picture

Do I ever hear you on that

Do I ever hear you on that one, my friend.

diana cage's picture

That outfit matching thing

That outfit matching thing was totally accidental and totally embarrassing!!
GAWD. I can't wait till we are lesbian in our seventies wearing matching jogging suits

Grace Moon's picture

Thanks for articulating

Thanks for articulating that.

Crandall and Cage pitched the series to really explore the culture/ aesthetics/history of "Butch Femme" which is a really sub-class of queer identity albeit a very important and visible sub-class. Clearly not everyone ascribes to it, we really just hoped to create the forum which people can discuss their experiences or thoughts on the subject.

some people do labels some don't... this goes without
saying.

xo

tweet tweet @gracemoon

Steph H's picture

lol. I shall make you

lol.

I shall make you unlimited cups of tea if and when you cross the big pond... (not quite as cool as going for catfish....)

x

Tex's picture

Those are brands here - just

Those are brands here - just wanted you to have a head start in case I cross the big pond for tea......but please, understand, I would never ever suggest a brand of tea to an Englishwoman. That would be totally inappropriate......

Not in Boston,

Tex

Twitter Time @kdhales

Rusty's picture

I didn't know how important

I didn't know how important the little things were until after my last relationship ended. Then my ex told me how much she loved having me open doors for her, etc.

As far as the question of acceptance of butch/femme in the lesbian community — I could no more stop being butch than I could stop being a lesbian. It might have been someone on this site that said, "I was butch before I was a lesbian." That's me, too. I understand that some people won't or can't label themselves. I'm fine with that; it's none of my business. It would be nice to get the same acceptance from people who shun labels.

"When you look for the bad in mankind expecting to find it, you surely will." ~ Pollyanna

Steph H's picture

Sorry that should read "Am I

Sorry that should read "Am I totally missing the point?"....

Sunday afternoon - my brain is a bit sluggish...xx

Steph H's picture

Are those blends of tea? Or

Are those blends of tea?

Or I am TOTALLY missing the point.....

K I T's picture

lol this only confirms why i

lol this only confirms why i suck at relationships,
with either men or women.

Also the reason why i live alone (and always will !)

I don't want nor need a domestic space i just want and need my space. i don't want to play house etc.

i don't do roles.
nor do i wish the other to do roles.

i just want to be me and ditto the other to be them selfs to.

i ain't butch nor am i fem

Different sex relationships worried about power dynamic?
if that is the case then it has nothing to do with gender / roles
but everything to do with the person just not being the right one for you. or else you would not have to worry about it.

i hold doors for others, let others go first, stand up for others to give them a seat in the bus etc. if i think that person should be sitting instead of me. help people out of jacks and hang them for them, help them with stepping out/in or of something etc. you name it. no mather what gender some one has
just because i feel like doing so and because its polite.

Allegra's picture

I don't believe in Butch

I don't believe in Butch Femme gender roles.
Both partners do what they know to do.
And the best is to try to help each other in everything.
This makes the couple to get closer and closer.
OMG I am so fuckin romantic person !!!!

Mab's picture

It's not okay to be bossed

It's not okay to be bossed around, period.

yonks's picture

It's not okay to be boss

It's not okay to be boss around by a femme?

-Do not follow me, I'M LOST-

Xanadu's picture

I've never understood the

I've never understood the whole 'opening doors' issue. I willl always open a door for anyone - man, woman, child ... cat. For me it's just good manners and it's one of those gestures that has a flow on effect in society... a bit like holding the elevator!

As a femme I'm happy to mow the lawn, get dirty in the garden and cook and sew.

Couples should just do the tasks that they are good at or passionate about, otherwise you end up bitter and frustrated.

Erin Blackwell's picture

but my friend LIKED it. my

but my friend LIKED it. my friend's "in love" -- she thinks it's great someone cares enough to boss her around. besides, it was stuff like, "Get my shawl." can you just see me inserting myself, trying to drape it around Sig-O's naked shoulders?

on the flipside, the GirlFriend was a fab-u-lous cook. so she wasn't just dead weight. but if anything, that just makes her grip all the more...

Xanadu's picture

I believe generation Y & Z

I believe generation Y & Z call this cyber-bullying ... Cut it out.

rovermom's picture

why are you saying what?

why are you saying what?

Lake's picture

What?

What?

Lake

Tex's picture

Be very wary of women who

Be very wary of women who expect you to perform....Wink

Twitter Time @kdhales

Tex's picture

Celestial Seasonings and

Celestial Seasonings and Bigelow woman here, just in case.....

Twitter Time @kdhales

Tex's picture

it is awful - you know, it

it is awful - you know, it is, well, just plain rude......

Twitter Time @kdhales

Sarah Pappalardo's picture

You probably should have

You probably should have gotten up and helped your friend while staring down the sig-O. Then you could have taken the awkwardness into your own hands and to a whole 'nuther level altogether.

conlite's picture

Thanks for the great video

Thanks for the great video blog! Enjoyed it immensely.

I have watched guy-girl dynamics among my straight friends and it seems to me that even in heteroville there is a right and wrong way to do this. Some guys open doors, carry out the trash, etc as an expression of their care and respect for the lady in question. Other guys do exactly the same things as an expression of their macho condescension and "ownership" of a woman. The former are usually flexible in finding a gender role with their partner and may venture to cook or do the dishes. The latter are usually looking for a domestic slave. (Straight women can also be flexible or inflexible in what they require of a man.)
I think the joy of butch-femme gay relationships is that we see the need to explore the roles and find the place of respect. (We see the need to even have this discussion!) Many straight folk assume its already all defined for them and then wonder why their relationship is falling apart! Clearly the straight world needs more visible butch-femme gay role models.....Smile

rovermom's picture

I had to stop about half way

I had to stop about half way through and just say...this is exactly what my hetero friends tell me. These roles that they play are not about oppressing or dominating - but about sex. I concur.

I spent most of my life single. About only 2 years of my life, I was actually in a relationship. I dated a guy for 3 months. Not my son's father. It was was so disconnected and awkward. But I learned from the experience. Even though I knew I was gay. I knew that I can live hetero, but it wouldn't be passionate...and when he broke up with me I was just was like ok. No crying or anything - I just went back to my life prior to him. No qualms; it was easy.

The first lesbian relationship - there wasn't any gender role play. She was 19 and I was 23. I had become emotionally charged. I started to become awake, by actually getting to act on my feelings. It wasn't about roles, but about discovery. We mixed and matched on so many levels. Though I felt more like a guy, but I think that's normal because I'm with a woman. Our media culture looks upon the eyes of being with a woman through the eyes of a guy. Or being with a guy through the eyes of a woman. So in the discovery, the instinct is to feel like the opposite of who you are with.

It's why "butch" can date "butch" - whether they look it or just act it, because they feel it.

My last relationship actually I had fun being the "femme". That relationship was all about sex. In our last days that was a question that I had brought up. Was our relationship about sex? She took quite long to answer it, and when she did - she denied it was about sex.

But it was.

Everything we did, we did with the idea to turn one another on, to have great sex. We completely role played, hinting and gesturing certain ways like a role.

I don't wear femme clothes, but when I do...I role play. And having control over that role is a turn on.

I don't wear ties and a suit, but when I do... I role play. And having control over that role is a turn on.

Gender role play is sexy. What isn't sexy, is expecting and confining the role plays onto one another. This even includes hetero relationships.

At one point playing house can get old, and there has to be more elements...unless the two (or more) people is willing to play house for the rest of their life.

It's really hard to balance playing and living and it takes time and patience to learn the understanding of one another.

It's not just playing house. Playing can be sexy - just there is more to it then just playing.

Lezbeth's picture

Okay, Cage, did you pick out

Okay, Cage, did you pick out the outfits for this? Nice color matching.

A dear friend of mine, now dead from AIDS, told me once that the fun thing about being gay is playing with the roles. He said that heteros believe they ARE their roles. It's all about choosing, not taking it too seriously. Otherwise, expectations turn into resentments.

Lezbeth's picture

I'm with you on this one,

I'm with you on this one, Kelly. There have been times when I felt too "responsible" for a partner who depended on me for things, including supporting us both, that were way too locked into the role. Ultimately, it's about making it up as you go.

Erin Blackwell's picture

the consistent cuppa, a

the consistent cuppa, a killa.

Erin Blackwell's picture

i recently witnessed the

i recently witnessed the unappetizing spectacle of a good friend being told by her lady love to do this, do that. my friend might have consented to being ordered around, but no one asked me if i wanted to sit there and watch. and yet manners (i do have some) forbade my objecting. awful.

Steph H's picture

"The tiny little things that

"The tiny little things that warm you like a bear hug in a blizzard".... I love that.

Steph H's picture

I so totally agree! I am not

I so totally agree! I am not a grand gestures person but I make my beloved a cup of tea every single night...

minniesota's picture

Is it okay if this tomboy

Is it okay if this tomboy covets Professor Crandall's tie? Smile

Still searching for the right brainy quote.